Is it normal that i don't like the idea of religion?

Please read the whole explanation before voting.

Now my main question here is about religion. I see religion as a dictatorship or a cult. Something where a leader tells you what to do and what to believe. When religion started, it was a sort of way to meet someone who believed what you did. Now we teach our children what we believe, and then when something happens, such as gay marriage being legalized [a whole other topic, we could be here for hours], everyone in the Catholic church turns to the Pope or flips through the bible like lost puppies, asking, "Is it okay? What should we think? What do we believe?" Instead of forming their own thoughts on the matter. They want to conform and fit in with what everyone else believes.

I was raised Roman Catholic, but not in an extreme family. I know my dad doesn't believe and my mom has doubts or little things she doesn't agree with the church about.

But do not misinterpret my question. I don't have a problem with people praying or believing. I do not have a problem with spirituality. I have a problem with religion.

So I ask you: Do you think its normal that I believe what I describe in the second paragraph?

Voting Results
97% Normal
Based on 35 votes (34 yes)
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Comments ( 44 )
  • thegypsysailor

    In my opinion, religion is the single greatest sin of mankind. All other sins are born of religion.

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    • What is sin?

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      • thegypsysailor

        A crime against nature, or the natural order of things.

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        • Is it a sin for a man to kill another man?

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          • thegypsysailor

            Not necessarily. What if one does so to protect another or his family?

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            • What if my family and I have been in a plane crash and it's just us and the pilot left alive. Everybody is OK except we are on a deserted island. Its been 2 weeks without food and if my kids don't eat they will die before the pilot does. Can I kill the pilot so my family can eat? He is a healthy middle aged man with a loving family at home.

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  • VinnyB

    Religion did not start as a way for people to meet like minded people. It started as a means of control. Claiming that your position as ruler was anointed or ordained by God, claiming to be a representative of God on earth, or claiming to be a living God yourself, was an excellent way of controlling the masses, and getting the masses to follow your rules and laws.

    This technique was used by the Egyptians, Romans, the Kings and Queens of Europe, and countless other societies through out history. There are still examples of this today, the Pope, as you mentioned, is am excellent one.

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  • beele

    I agree. the way I understand it is that religions used to hold people in a community, it was essentially their set of rules and morals to live by no matter what, and people still try to use it that way now, but it doesn't work the same anymore. It isn't necessary to our society, not that I'm against it at all.

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    • Dad

      ok, well I'm against religion, but obviously not the people.

      By the way beele, I'm not sure if you were 'reply'ing to me or not? But I was lucky to see your comment (just happened to check old posts), since I don't get any notification at all if you just post a new comment; ONLY the OP who started the topic will be alerted to new comments. But replies to members the OP and that member get a flag to state someone replied.

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      • beele

        Yes, yes I meant to reply!

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  • beele

    All religions were first created as a way for humans to explain the world around them and the purpose of their own lives.
    That being said, I do not consider myself religious. I don't believe entirely any religious theories, stories, etc. But I do understand why they exist.
    I believe that everyone should learn about all religions and be able to make their own choice to believe what they want to believe, and also have the choice of not being religious.
    I consider myself spiritual, and have nothing against those who are or are not religious no matter what.
    It's nice for a family to share a religion, I understand, but it shouldn't be a requirement for anyone. It should be a choice.

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    • Dad

      "I believe that everyone should learn about all religions and be able to make their own choice to believe what they want to believe"

      Even militant atheists agree with that.
      The only issue is adults who decide on a religion (whichever they like), obviously shouldn't put that onto their children! Since: "I believe that everyone should learn about all religions and be able to make their own choice to believe what they want to believe"

      The problem is: ALL religious adults instruct their children they MUST believe! The reason why they do this is because: Christianity do not praise the lord you will go to hell. Islam do not believe in Allah get killed (usually horrifically).

      These things are requirements of religion.
      So to say believe whatever you religiously like but allow your kids to do the same, is out of the question.
      You wouldn't 'believe' howmany atheist stories (real ones btw) where the atheist child has been literally thrown out of their religious home. Its the norm for religious believers, DUE to the belief itself.

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  • theseeker

    Almost my entire family is religious except for me. Growing up I was taught to be a Christian. My father was the most religious person I've ever known and he preached about it a lot. He even claimed he seen things and had spiritual experiences. As a kid, I was brainwashed into it like many others, but then my father died as a kid.

    Somewhere along the way I said fuck it! I can think for myself. I've come to the conclusion religion is BS. There's all these different religions out there that claim to be true, but who who gives a fuck who the messenger is, did you get the message? In the big scheme of it they pretty much got the same damn message! Religion is simply about morals and rules for people to follow. I also think it's meant to help people make them feel better about themselves, such as being forgiven when you mess up or that there is a life after this. Religion has some good messages, but it also has biases and flaws.

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    • Dad

      I can understand you 'think' that's what religion is, sadly its wrong but at least you feel like religion is all good and you still think its BS, even more remarkable than most. Here's some more thought to help you stay on track.

      There are no good morals in religion. None.
      Please provide 1 good moral. If you decide to pick an easy one like, Thou shalt not kill, then be aware this is a human trait. We don't go around killing people for no reason. The only time I see mass genocide going on is when religion is involved or the actual specific excuse for it.

      It is not proven that there was a man called jesus who stated he was the son of god. At the time and for decades later (10's of years, not 1 year, not 5 years, but about 40 years) AFTER his death then only the single bible book came out. Up until that time no one wrote a thing? So strange!

      People are NOT forgiven in religion. They are all sinners (Lol) where they must all praise the lord, or go to hell. What absolute rubbish, and adults tell children this?? They should put a crime against such abuse.

      I'm not aware of any good messages of religion? I'd be highly interested to know just 1.
      On the contrary we are now agree with equality of the sexes and no slavery! And an entire book of thousands of horrible other things (even killing children?!).

      Yes there's lots of confusing flaws too. But to be 'Christian' and follow the bible will end you up in jail, unless you feel stoning your children to death is ok?

      For you to reach the concept that religion is wrong EVEN though you thought it was good is remarkable.
      Once you know all the bad stuff you'll think religion is hell on Earth :)

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      • theseeker

        Coming from the family I was raised in, you're right it is pretty remarkable I have come to this conclusion. It took me some time. I was on the fence for awhile, but now I've opened my eyes and I see the reality.
        I can't say I completely agree with you about religion though. Every story in the bible has some underlying message, but many of them could be interpreted in multiple ways. There are indeed some good morals. For example, don't commit adultery. That's an issue not everyone seems to understand these days. However, you could argue that these morals are all common sense, but then the question becomes where did common sense come from?

        Possibly the most important concept of religion is it does help keep people in line to a degree. If you do good things people are told they get to go to this happy place called heaven and if they do bad things they will burn in hell. Does it sound ridiculous? Absolutely, but for some reason people believe it! Of course, nobody wants to burn in hell so most people follow the rules. However, I do agree with you that the idea you must praise the lord, or go to hell is a pretty absurd message.

        You're right there are definitely bad messages in religion, which is why I don't follow it anymore. Like I said earlier, religion is JUST ONE way we are manipulated and controlled to be what they want us to be in this society, which also tells you how I feel about our society as well. I don't need religion because I feel very confident in my own beliefs and rationale, and I act accordingly.

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        • Dad

          You actually sound like the type of person who could be excellent as an atheist once you're there :D Since I tend to be a bit militant about it, and that's not good.

          Yes I could easily argue about adultery and anything else human (human things are actually allowed), I can even debate about how religion states only 144,000 will ONLY go to heaven, but I'm sure any religious person can inform you of this but they tend to miss these scriptures (plus out of that amount you have to be a virgin and etc etc etc etc etc) Seriously the heaven idea is even out of bounds for most religious people :)

          Plus the origin of morals seem to go back well before religion. These days we base our morals on intellectuals and the public coming together to form what is generally accepted in our culture. The point is morals change - this has been clearly proven and I won't go into it (but I can of course).

          As for society (and religion) keeping people in line - Yes, but religious fanatics (although it has now been stated just religious people) can do very bad things, all they need is their god to tell them! And excuse them. THAT's actually the biggest problem with religion (even worse than that child abuse thing). Religious people can do are able to (and do) very inhumane things. Not rational people. But I won't go into that because HUGE topic and its easily confirmed.

          Atheism specifies > Think for yourself, ask questions, acquire knowledge, seek answers. Mind you even a child can be atheist, and generally all children under 10 are already (all of them).
          Atheism > The lack of belief in any deity. Is not a, I tell you this and you learn, type of situation. It is opening up your mind to ALL religions (maybe Allah is right? Billions think so!) And with all the info YOU deciding if there's enough to make you believe in a god. Up to now, there has been zero proof, not even religious morals are followed by people, adultery is not accepted by our society because we feel 1 person should love another only and anyone else is looked upon as a fault or problem. Its not world accepted and it may even change here (again) one day, but it will be decided by rational reasonable people, not dogmatic i told you so non rational religious people :D (hence separation church and state).

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          • theseeker

            Atheism? I have asked myself that question many times, the answer is no, and I don't think I ever will be. I'd say I'm agnostic, which is the belief there is no way of knowing if there is a God or there isn't because there's simply no way of proving it one way or the other. Despite everything I've said about religion, I still believe there might be a God. I just don't agree with how religion describes God and an afterlife. Maybe after we die we do indeed go to a happier place, maybe we become one with nature and the environment, maybe nothing happens and everything goes blank. I'm not really sure to be honest, but I definitely don't think we go floating in the clouds and meet St. Peter at the pearly gates, or burn in a lake of fire lol.

            I like to believe we all have a spirit or a soul. Something inside of us that makes us all unique and alive. If so, I think it's possible our soul could live on after death. I've known people who claimed they had spiritual experiences, such out-of-body experiences(OBE). I'm not really sure whether to believe them or not. The human mind is extremely powerful so it's tough to say if they really had such an experience, or they just truly believed they did, but really didn't.

            Furthermore, I actually believe the idea of creation before evolution. Obviously, that's another conversation, but the way I see it something had to be created first in order to evolve.

            Of course, there's no way to know for sure or to prove any of this. I'm not spiritual in any way and I don't pray or anything because I'm simply unsure.

            When it comes to religion, we could spend a lifetime discussing it. There are so many theories you could argue that branch off into other topics, but I don't see myself ever being an Atheist for the reasons I've mentioned.

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            • Dad

              "I actually believe the idea of creation before evolution."
              I assume you mean the 1 split second before we already know as fact? ie 13.8 billion years ago.
              You don't need to answer that because I expect yes, if its a no then that would end any conversation between you and any other rational person.
              You need to be careful with that word. Creationists believe in a 6000 year old universe, plus genesis and just too many other horrors to mention.
              Science knows all the way up to the split second after the big bang. The evidence is now stronger than the science of gravity. Its just fully accepted now. And I won't hear of anything without merit against it :D

              Again atheism is just lack of evidence in a god(s).
              Unless you have real evidence (not feelings, or personal OBE experiences!) Then you are atheist but just won't admit it.

              I also didn't like how you said all life have souls (I seriously hope you just don't think people who have been around for 200K years only). Souls is another religious term. Science has never found a soul, but they have found excellent reasons why people's brains see memories of their relatives and inevitably a bright light before they die. So far that's all answered too, guess what, all natural stuff of the physical brain.

              You said not the religious god etc, but it sure sounds close, or possibly just confused about the present things we know already. The brain holds personality, memories and emotions (among the many others). Once dead (and rotting) it cannot have any of these things, hence why ghosts can't be real, nor can reincarnation nor a spirit leaving our body, unless you are talking about some type of release that entails nothing of your personality (or you) what so ever.

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  • theseeker

    To your question, I agree with you. As long as people are raised right I don't think you necessarily need religion to understand what's right and wrong. I think it's better for people to be able to think for themselves to form their own opinions because in some ways religion is just one way we are manipulated in this society. Perfect example, you bring up the gay thing. That's a horrible bias in the bible, yet many who follow it support the idea that gays are "bad" even though it's unreasonable because that's what they're told to believe. Gays can't help that they are gay. Just like I can't help that I'm a man attracted to woman. I'm not trying to get into all that, but it proves the point is valid.

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  • cosmictripster

    I used to think the exact same way. I changed my opinion over time though by looking at it different.

    Now I like the idea of religion as the main idea seems to be that of love. I don't like most actual religions however as humans seem to misinterpret the idea way too often.

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    • TrustMeImLying

      What do you mean looking at it differently? Care to elaborate?

      (for the record, I'm not asking that to ambush you, so you don't need to have your guard up ;) Sincere curiosity)

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      • cosmictripster

        Well instead of looking at religion for what it is I've started looking at it for what it was meant to be. I don't know a lot about religion but at the core of most religions the message seems to be love. It's a great message, it just seems like people misinterpret it into something hateful or self righteous way too often.

        I'd consider myself more of a spiritual person than religious though, somewhere in the ballpark of agnostic maybe.

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        • Dad

          Well agnostic is really just a transition stage, and the more you ask and seek answers I'm positive you'll come to understand that all religions are nonsense. But we'll just let that be because its better for you learn that, as blanket statement of 'this is it' don't generally help - you know like religion states :)

          Anyway, love is not the core of religion.
          The simplest example comes to mind how parents should not love their children but leave them to god. There are many examples of this in the bible (killing son, raping children, killing children etc etc) The bible itself (the core of Christianity) is full of hate, violence and fear.

          I would go as far as saying that although good (loving) people may follow religion, religion itself is not love.

          Religion is about faith. It is about praising that faith (regularly) and placing all of life, relationships, family, and money below that.

          "I'd consider myself more of a spiritual person than religious though"

          Even atheists have an uplifting or awe of their being and the environment and life around them, including the beauty of the universe. 'Some' may call it a spiritual awareness, but NOT in a religious way :)

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          • cosmictripster

            Yea what you said in you're last paragraph is what I meant by spiritual almost spot on. And like I said I haven't done my research on religions so you're probably right. Could you explain what you meant by agnostic being a transition stage though?

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            • Dad

              Thanks for the reply.
              Yes I can describe what I mean by agnosticism.

              Lets say you said you were atheist. Actually lets say that I'm saying that about me.
              Anyway, there's zero evidence in any god or deity and not only that from what I see everything seems to be natural. All life evolved (even the Pope agrees with this). Planets and galaxies form naturally.
              THEN, all of a sudden, a group of stars in the sky mysteriously line up and say GOD.
              At this stage I'm thinking aliens, but I must admit that's pretty hard evidence that all can see. Then a man comes up and says I'm the son of god and I can cure the sick and even when I die you can lock my body up in a cave and it will actually vanish (rise) to the heavens.

              Well, this then happens. And I'd have to say at that stage (millions of people cured of cancer, stars in the sky, and inevitably his guarded body vanishes) that there IS evidence and therefore I'd probably sway towards a god, or VERY intelligent being.

              My point is, that atheists are atheists because there's no reasonable evidence to believe in a god (sadly there's actually NO evidence). BUT, if evidence happen to come and all could see it (ie I wasn't deluded), then obviously I'd believe. Again so far - none.

              Agnostic states their could be a god but not really sure.
              But that is wrong. That's like saying there's a flying spaghetti monster or teacup floating in space! There 'could' be I suppose, buuuut, I'm swaying to atheist on that too. Since there is no evidence, and as I originally stated: All life evolved (even the Pope agrees with this). Planets and galaxies form naturally.

              Also, hopefully you are aware that humans (in human form) have only been on Earth for about ~200,000 years. If you think about that you'll see, not very long. But LIFE (all extinct) has been on Earth for about 4 billion years. If I were god I'd probably make the FIRST lifeforms the souls life :D. Not wait (from start of universe) > 13.79 BILLION years then say yep humans have souls! That's not really a perfect god moment in my view.

              I've rambled, but does anything make sense there? I'll be very brief next time :)

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  • sillygirl77

    Religions all seem like cults to me.

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  • Dad

    You are talking about religious morals.
    Society is not based upon religious morals anymore. Separation of church and state has cured this.

    So when the leaders (lol) in church state their nonsense it has no affect on anything UNTIL they place these mythical ideas onto children. It is child abuse to lie to a child and say god will burn them in hell if they don't praise the lord. Its horrible what they do.

    By the way these leaders live in mansions and buy expensive new cars, and they drive these cars to church but no one cares, not even the poor. The 'leaders' of the church are the worst of them all.

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    • My leader died on a cross.
      At least that's what they tell me.
      I'm pretty sure hes just hiding from mean people.

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      • Dad

        Yes he seems to be hiding from all life.
        I've said it before that if (when) I die and to my shock there's a god in front of me I'd kill him on the spot. He has done the worst horrible job for entirety of life on Earth including humans. Pretty sure he would be seen as a sadist. Um even if real, (which is ridiculous) I'm not praising that.

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  • Ace09

    U know, when u say sth is normal, it's based on what u think the most of the world think. So right now, ur actually asking if ur idea conform and fits in with what everyone else believes.
    Now, I'm an atheist, and TBH (based on what I said above) , we're kinda "not" normal.
    And let me tell ya, in this case, I'd rather be a freak than believe what they say.

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