Is it normal that i think war is natural

I hear the argument that war isnt natural nor is it good in a way. I believe differently. First off I believe war is completely natural for any species that has a large collective inteligence and is also social. It honestly makes the most sense when it comes to accomplishing basic goals as a species.

Feel free to read my explanation or just skip it and comment.

My logic here is that every single organism has 3 goals. 1 to survive. 2 to reproduce. 3 to make sure the next generation survives. Within that context war is completely rational.

Surviving is important, so much so that doing whatever you have to, to do so is acceptable. If a population has maximized its land usage it has one of two options expand said land or lose population due to starvation. Combine this with other tribes with the same mindset as you and you have war on your hands. As tribes become civilizations with hundreds of thousands of mouths to feed. Expansion or getting more food is top priority because limiting population is not normally doable because the general population isn't controlled for the good of the entire populations resources. Thus resource wars.

To that end every war is a resorce war either over physical space or the ability to increase food production (land, slaves, technology, long term investments for the future, etc) of course you can always label a cause of the war for other factors but the root of the war is of the above factors.

As for the contribution to war it has significantly advanced technology because nothing rushes inspiration like having your way of life threatened. Though I'm not a warmonger since basic needs of the above are fulfilled in much of the world thus war isnt needed as much as it was.

Modern war is highly inefficient now a days because there is no more land to conquer. The majority of the world is interconnected by way of economic ties (very efficient way of gathering resources though its was less effective when there was land to be taken over and traveling technology was in its infancy)

You mad lad! You got through the explanation/rant. Pat yourself on the back for reading through that wall of text.

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Based on 18 votes (15 yes)
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Comments ( 51 )
  • Pat yourself on the back for not actually typing a wall of text, but instead typing cohesive, spaced paragraphs with decent grammar.

    I think you're right about war being natural, and the typical base causes for war. However, I would also include greed and lust for power as factors for war. Civilizations often want to expand and conquer whether they have a problem with resource scarcity or not.

    You could say that's just the drive the survive again by preventing resource scarcity, but by definition, when the desire and drive to possess more becomes excessive, it's called greed anyway.

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  • private3

    Didn't read the post but yes, it's normal.

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  • TerriAngel

    Youre almost right.
    2 goals.
    As der fur found out.
    Theres 2 strongest drives in man:
    1 survival.
    2 reproduction.
    Since he didnt like gay.
    He allowed whore houses in the camps.
    Because even starved and facing an oven.
    guys still want to plant their seed.
    Sadly even guards took the opportunity.
    Gov. Ronald ray gun found the same challenge.
    He opposed prison rape.
    So, he approved conjugal visits.
    So, theres 2 basic needs.
    War happens.
    But its wasteful and pointless.
    How much further would our world be?
    1 one language.
    2 No separate religion.
    3 People being responcible with birth control.

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  • raisinbran

    We were made to kill each other because the odds of being born male to female are 50/50. The odds should be more like 20/80.

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    • Actually males are born more in times after war. I think the actual percentages is 51/49 male to female birthrates. While females die from childbirth males tend to die from everything else way more.

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  • McBean

    The OP makes good points except

    1. It is generally better to own the world than to rule the world.
    2. When old men think up wars for young men, they almost always weaken their own country.

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    • Isnt that what I said in the ending statements? Warfare now is now a very inefficient way to get resources. Trading is far more efficient since we have modern technology backing up transportation and logistics.

      The wars we have now is in a category of: it will be a good investment in the long run kind of thinking. We keep on shelling the middleast, but do they have anything more advanced then Soviet era technology? Not really. What it seems NATO and the USA is doing is stagnating the process of non cooperating nations that openly state genocide of their neighbors. I perfer this way of thinking rather than having a genocide or another world war.

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      • McBean

        Not exactly what you said. Manufacturing is a better way generate wealth. Ruling the world like the U.S. does takes lots of money and is mostly ego driven.

        I disagree with your comment on war being a good investment. I would say balance of power is a deterrent to war, but there is no balance at present. NATO has all the military power.

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        • Manufacturing without someone to trade to is a fruitless endeavor or should I say cutting out the world from your product isnt a good way to do buisness.

          The usa doesnt rule the world. It has what 1/20th of the population? The usa just has the most allies of any country. Paired with the biggest economy and most prolific culture spreading (music, food, language) gives the impression that we rule a good chunk of the world.

          The whole middle east isnt a threat to nato the threat is the China and russia it just so happens that's where we fight our proxy wars now.

          The trading of our men for their men is a very good exchange truth be told. We only lost around 4 thousand troops from the war in 2003 till now. Their losses were much much higher.

          The technology brought from these wars also is going to save hundreds of thousands over the next few years. Now instead of shelling a city we can pick and choose what building we want to take out.

          Of course we want to get that number down of deaths on our side as much as possible but looking at the numbers we are doing pretty good.

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  • bigbudchonga

    War is just evolution

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    • LloydAsher

      Ants wage war. Wolves wage war. Apes certainly wage war.

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      • bigbudchonga

        Agreed, it might be on a smaller scale, but the sentiment is the same

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        • LloydAsher

          It just so happens that humans are way, way more sophisticated in war then any other species. Humans are weak individually but we make up for it with kinship to ones tribe or banner. Numbers are needed to do literally everything.

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          • UselessTrash2

            Idk about us being the best, ants are very good at war too. have you seen any documentaries about super colonies? You should watch them, they're very interesting

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            • LloydAsher

              I mean sophisticated as in how we do it. There is a few dozen ways to win a war but all ants do is attack the other ant until it is dead or you are dead. Humans use assasination, funding coup d'etats, starving the opponents, political marriages and gifts, devaluing the opponents currency, making alliances, showing off a big stick, and I'm pretty sure theres a few books beyond what I can state here.

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  • TheBlindInquisitor

    I'm 50/50 on that.

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  • SmokeEverything

    fights over territory and resources are natural, war is engineered by the rich to gain more wealth and is unnatural. Money is unnatural. Animals in the wild fight but they don't go to war.

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    • xxLucifer

      Wars have been fought for other reasons rather than money. The crusades was about religion, revolutionary war was to overthrow a tyrannical government, WW2 was caused by German nationalism, Cold War was caused by tensions between democratic and communist nations. It's actually not typically about money. Money is most often just a side factor in wars, it's a means to an end.

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      • People are the ultimate resource. Having more members is essential to gain power. While these countries were seperate they all had an alliance with eachother through religion.

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      • SmokeEverything

        WW2 was caused by the displaced monarchies and crooked bankers of europe. The cold war was a complete psyop centered around pseudoscience and hoaxes like "nuclear weapons" (FAKE) and the idea that human beings have the technology to go to space (ALSO FAKE) and the people providing the materials to make weapons make a ton of money. Carnegie steel provided the metal to build the rails to carry people to Auschwitz. All of these are completely unnatural events caused ON PURPOSE by tyrants and crooked financiers. If war was natural animals in nature would go to war.

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        • I dont know if you are trolling because I unfortunately know people this stupid.

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          • SmokeEverything

            Why is it stupid? Because it disagrees with lies you've been taught?

            Small children think their teachers are brilliant geniuses who know everything until they grow up and realize teachers are just regular people regurgitating information they were taught. The function of government-sponsored education is to make sure dumb children grow up believing what they government wants them to, big suprise. The president reads lines off a teleprompter that were written by somebody else and you think you aren't watching just another fake TV show.

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            • Why would the USSR agree we landed on the moon? They had every single reason not to agree with us but lo and behold they agree we landed on the moon. If we could land on the moon having a semi permanent instillation in space isnt that hard of a leap

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        • xxLucifer

          I thought you were simply misinformed. Turns out you are either a troll or conspiracy theorist. If you are a conspiracy theorist I don't mind debating you, but I'd rather not deal with trolls.

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          • SmokeEverything

            Not a conspiracy theorist, just done some independent research. If you can actually watch NASAs really crappy space station videos and believe that's actually really happening, or that they couldn't be faking videos like that, you probably also believe Ernie and Bert are real people.

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            • xxLucifer

              You can literally see the space station from the ground. With the naked eye it looks like just a fast moving ball of light. If you have a strong enough telescope you can see the space station in pretty good detail. You want to see it yourself just buy a telescope for a couple hundred bucks, figure out the flight path, then hope it's a clear night.

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            • DIO

              You are stupid. And I'm pretty sure you know it yourself.
              Your independent research sound like a kid that believes the moon is inhabited by rabbits because he read it on the internet.
              Get real. Time to grow up.

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    • Gaining as much power as possible is natural.

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      • SmokeEverything

        Survival is natural. Wealth is an illusion sold to you by your slave handlers.

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  • litelander8

    I once heard of nine worms that marched to war. They had no idea what they were fighting for.

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